Listen to the chapter here!
[Bulle]
When you travel to Nairobi or other parts or when you go to a foreign country, she used to tell us that may the people of that place be your brothers and sisters. So once you visualize something, you have to do something about it. So me, I said I will not reject any offer.
Beside the school books, which I think schools, the work is to shape you to become a worker, but other books, the non academic books shape you to become a better human being, a better person.
[Neil]
Hey everybody, this is Neil Pasricha. Welcome or welcome back to 3 books. The only podcast in the world buying for book lovers, writers, makers, sellers, and librarians.
I got a special chapter for you today, chapter 155 with Bulle, the bookseller. I flew all the way over to Nairobi, Kenya. So this is kind of like the second chapter in our three part Africa series.
I know it's not really an Africa series so much as it is a Kenya series. And Kenya was the only country I visited in Africa. However, it was my first foray to the 55 country, 1.5 billion person continent. And so I tried my best to collect stories while I was there. Our guest in chapter 104, you may recall was Boniface Mwangi, the photojournalist, the activist who's now running for president of Kenya. When I got to Nairobi, he sent me a text saying, I have the perfect guest for you.
I already had a couple planned with his help, but he's like, I got the perfect guest for you. So late at night, the first night I got there after coming in off, off of an overnight flight, my belly stuffed full of fresh samosas and pakoras that I ate for breakfast along with goat tripe. First time in my life I ever had goat tripe.
I'm pretty sure that's what I ate. A really chewy, curried intestine of a goat, which was delicious, but I never ate it before, but I ate it. That night, I loaded up my podcast bag.
I got picked up by Perlexi, the wonderful and kind driver who drives Boniface Mwangi around. And, and his assistant and really a cerebral counterpart to Bonnie. And he drove me over to Nuria Bookshop.
And so, you know, when I think bookshop here in Canada, I'm sort of thinking, you know, maybe it's on the main street. Maybe it's in a plaza. Maybe it's in a mall.
There's like a walk-up bookstore with a frontage onto the road or the street or the mall entrance. Not the case here. This was a busy downtown CBD Nairobi, so central business district.
It's, it's not a tent scene, but you got to kind of keep your wits about you. There's people walking in all directions. There's like a throb, throbbing nature of this city with kind of music going on, people kind of everywhere.
And we go into this plaza. We go up to the second floor and then we curve into the front of a small, I'd say probably about a thousand square foot bookshop right there in this plaza. I'm introduced to Bule.
His name is spelled B-U-L-L-E, but it's pronounced Bulle. He said like bullet with no T. A Kenyan born man who was raised 700 kilometers north of the city by largely his camel herding grandmother, and a family that has kind of come down and sort of spread roots.
So Bulle has a really fascinating story. I don't want to take too much away from it, but needless to say, he went the business route and then as life often does, life intervened. Today, he's running the most successful and most prominent bookstore in all of Kenya, where he actually promotes self-published African authors in a way that's very successful and supportive.
So we are going to talk all things Africa in Africa itself with Bulle the bookseller. It's a wonderful and interesting and stimulating conversation that I won't forget, and I hope you enjoy it as well. Let's jump and flip the page into chapter 155.
Hi, Bulle. Hi. My name is Neil.
I feel like, you know, I met you about five minutes ago, but because we have so many connections, I feel like I've known you a long time.
[Bulle]
It's nice. Since you have roots in Kenya, your mother is a Kenyan, so maybe that's the reason why we had that connection.
[Neil]
Plus, Boniface Mwangi, our guest in chapter 104, he says this is his favorite bookstore in the whole country.
[Bulle]
Yeah, he is, and he really supported me. So when we struck his book, he's a friend and very dear to me as well, and he's running for president in a beautiful country. Hopefully, we pray for him, and he has a chance to become number one in 2027, God willing.
[Neil]
Absolutely. I love and courage. Love and courage.
And I'm excited. You know, this is a show by and for book lovers, writers, makers, sellers, and librarians. It's a book podcast for book people.
And here we are sitting in your beautiful bookstore, which, by the way, I know it says 4.8 on Google, which is hard. I've never seen a bookstore ranked so high with hundreds of reviews. It's like the best ranked bookstore I've seen.
Thanks. And we're sitting in Nairobi. You say Kenya, my mom says Kenya, Kenya, Kenya.
[Bulle]
It depends on the accent, but we call it Kenya.
[Neil]
Yeah. How do you describe Kenya to people who aren't from here? Because we're sitting and it's hot, it's dark, we're upstairs in a building, it's noisy, there's lights, there's lots.
But if I tell people I'm doing a podcast in Kenya or Kenya, how do you describe this country to them? Our listeners are all over the world.
[Bulle]
We are the home of champions. We are known for marathon. So Elid Kipchoge, I think the guy who broke the two-hour, I think, marathon.
Yeah. He comes from Kenya. We are on east of Africa.
[Neil]
Yes.
[Bulle]
We are known for innovation. Kenya innovated the first mobile transfer. Really?
Where you can easily send money. Really? From one number to another number.
[Neil]
Really? I did not know that. That's why everybody here is always saying M-Pesa.
[Bulle]
M-Pesa, yes.
[Neil]
Which I never heard of before I got here.
[Bulle]
It's the fastest and safest. So you cannot lose money if you have money in your M-Pesa account. And it has close to, I think, 35, 40 million Kenyans who are subscribed to M-Pesa.
[Neil]
Wow. And it has- There's only 58 or something million, right?
[Bulle]
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 35, 40, yeah. We are close to 60 million.
60 million? Yeah, so our next census will be 2029. So I think the previous census in 2019, I think, was over 50 million.
[Neil]
Yeah.
[Bulle]
So now we are over 50, 57 million.
[Neil]
Wow, it's growing fast.
[Bulle]
Yeah, we are growing fast. So we are also ahead of, I think, most countries, not only in Africa, in terms of innovation, in terms of adapting to technology. So there are a lot of crypto users in Kenya as well.
Interesting. We use a lot of cryptocurrency in Kenya. At some point, we used to accept Bitcoin, Ethereum, and Doge.
At the bookstore? Yes, yes. If you want to buy a book, you can use coins to buy books equivalent to that.
[Neil]
You still do?
[Bulle]
Yeah, we do. We still accept Bitcoin. We still accept it if you have.
So even though in Kenya, people use it for not buying goods and services, but for trading purposes, for holding and selling it, for buy and sell. So we have a lot of traders who use crypto in Kenya.
[Neil]
A lot of traders in Kenya. A country, a burgeoning, fast-growing country of nearly 60 million people, full of marathon runners, technology innovators, Bitcoin owners, interesting bookstores. This is the culture you're describing.
And apparently, I heard this is one of the youngest demographics in the world.
[Bulle]
It is, it is. We have Gen Zs and Gen Alphas, of course, millennials like me. So we have fairly a good number of young Kenyans.
[Neil]
Average age is like, what, 18 to 25 or something like that? Yes, yes. Because why?
Why is it so? Most countries are the opposite. Canada, Japan, everyone's dying and getting old.
China, Singapore, it's like a population.
[Bulle]
I think we are fertile and we're still producing.
[Neil]
Fertile and producing. Exactly. Fertile and producing, technology, innovation.
This is a nice stage set because I'm seeing a lot of these things in the story. I mean, this bookstore is known for being very innovative. You said Bonnie was a friend of yours because you started carrying the book and then he was coming into the bookstore.
But you carry, as I understand it, 1,800 self-published authors' books.
[Bulle]
Yeah. Currently, as of today, we have over 2,500 self-published authors. Initially, when we started, we started promoting Kenyan authors.
We expanded to Africa, African authors. Now, we support over 2,550 independent authors.
[Neil]
2,550 independent authors, which is mesmerizing. We're going to get into that because it's mesmerizing to me for a lot of reasons. Because most bookstores you walk in and there's like three self-published books in the corner that nobody wants to buy and they're dusty.
And there's a guy maybe at a table trying to sell them. But you've actually turned that on its head. Innovation from Kenya, we talked about.
And you've made that the center point of your business. So you're a millennial. Yes.
Where'd you grow up? How'd you get into this? Where did this come from?
Where did this bookstore idea come from?
[Bulle]
I'm an ex-banker. I worked in the banking industry for eight and a half years. I was born in northern part of Kenya, a place, a county called Wajir.
[Neil]
W-A-J-I-R.
[Bulle]
Yes.
[Neil]
Northern part of Kenya, which means that borders close to Somalia?
[Bulle]
Somalia and Ethiopia.
[Neil]
Ah, Somalia, Ethiopia.
[Bulle]
So it's, I think, 700 kilometers from Nairobi. 700 to 800 kilometers from Nairobi.
[Neil]
On bumpy roads.
[Bulle]
So it's there. Yes, it is.
[Neil]
Okay. Oh, there's a map of Kenya up there. We're going to throw a picture on it.
So if you're watching this on YouTube, the map will flash up right now.
[Bulle]
Yeah, that's the map of Kenya. So I went to school, my primary, 1984. 1984.
That is May 10th, May. May 10th, 1984.
[Neil]
My wife is 1985. I'm 1979. So you're right in between us.
And you're born near which border? Is your family from Kenya?
[Bulle]
My father used to be a police officer. So yes, my father was born here. My grandfather was born here as well.
So way before we got independence. So I went to high school and primary school in Wajir. But I did my university here in Nairobi.
[Neil]
Wow. And the year of Kenyan independence is 1964. My mom was born in Nairobi in 1950, the youngest of eight children in Pangani neighborhood.
So her family also is kind of pre-independence. And after you grew up there, your dad was a police officer. Mom?
[Bulle]
My mom, no. My mom never went to school. So she stayed home.
[Neil]
She was home helping you?
[Bulle]
My father. So she's the one who raised us. Though we come from an extended family.
So my father had other wives.
[Neil]
Yes, right. Multiple wives.
[Bulle]
Exactly, yeah.
[Neil]
Is that cultural, religious?
[Bulle]
Religious and also culturally. There are many African cultures who practice polygamy.
[Neil]
Yeah, it's common around the world.
[Bulle]
It's both culture and religion. And from my mom's side, we're seven.
[Neil]
Which religion?
[Bulle]
I'm Muslim. Muslim? I'm a Muslim, yeah.
[Neil]
And culture is?
[Bulle]
Somali.
[Neil]
Somali, Somali Muslim. Yes.
[Bulle]
OK.
[Neil]
Not to label because everybody's everything. Everybody's everything. But just you're giving us some nice background on you.
[Bulle]
So from my father's side, we're 14. From my mother's side, we're seven.
[Neil]
Wow. Yeah. 14, what, kids?
[Bulle]
Yes, kids, yeah.
[Neil]
You have 14 brothers and sisters?
[Bulle]
Yes. Seven from my mom and the rest are from three of his wives.
[Neil]
So three of his wives. You grow up there. Yes.
You become a banker. Yes. I'm still not following how this gets into the books.
But I'm also curious, as a kid, if anything you read in your life, any books you read, because the underpinning of the show, of course, is what are the books that shaped you and changed you? Do you remember when you were growing up in northern Kenya? Yes.
[Bulle]
I remember my father, he never went to school. During the earlier years, even before independence and after independence, any person who was healthy used to be forced into serve military or police. So him, he used to work as a house help in an AP camp.
AP camp? Yeah, an administration police camp. Okay.
[Neil]
If you're healthy, you're in the military or the police.
[Bulle]
Exactly.
[Neil]
We need you.
[Bulle]
I think he was recruited when he was young, the age of 18, 19. And he became an administration police officer. Okay.
He didn't know how to speak Swahili or English.
[Neil]
What did he speak?
[Bulle]
Somali. So he learned both while he was in camp. That's unbelievable.
[Neil]
I've always heard these stories, like I didn't know anything. Yesterday, I met a guy in Amsterdam who said he landed there from Syria. They told him it was Canada.
That's what he told me in Newport. He told me he didn't figure it out for a year and he didn't know any of the languages. Obviously, Dutch, it's a bit hard to learn.
But these people, like your dad, he just learns a whole new language.
[Bulle]
So he learned, I think while he was trained, and he speaks fluent English. He also worked in Middle East. He speaks Arabic.
He speaks Swahili, of course, fluently. So since he never went to school, he made sure that all his kids get education.
[Neil]
Oh, interesting. He never went to school, so he wanted to make sure all of his kids, which, by the way, was a lot because there was a lot of kids to do that. It was a lot of kids to do this for.
[Bulle]
Because his father died when he was 13 years old, and all the burden now shifted to our grandmother, which was his mother. My grandmother is 100 plus years old now.
[Neil]
She's alive.
[Bulle]
She's alive. She's alive, yeah. She used to be a camel herder, so she used to keep camel goats.
So she raised all the kids by herself. So that's how my father now ended up in serving administration police.
[Neil]
So when you were born, your then 60-year-old camel herder grandmother raised you.
[Bulle]
Yes. So my father now, what he started doing is every time he used to come home, he must come with books or some gifts, and part of those gifts used to be books. But then I was not fond of reading books at that time.
Yes, I used to go to school, but used to have a lot of books at our home. I still have some of those old books. Some used to be on science, some biology, chemistry, some on nature.
So I used to love nature as well. My father used to love nature. Fast forward to the fourth from my father's side, no, number five from my father's side, and number three from my mom's side.
So he succeeded to take, while he was working, two of my brothers to study in India to do their degree there. So one is a lawyer and another one is an IT. So when later on, he managed now to take two of my sisters to school as well, and I was the fifth to go to university in Nairobi.
So I think that's what he did to raise us and to at least make sure that we go to school and we get necessary education so that we at least make our lives better. So I fell in love with books while I was on campus. So when I joined my first year, the first book that really changed my life, I think it's the second year, was The Power of Your Subconscious Mind.
[Neil]
The Power of Your Subconscious Mind. But this childhood that you've quickly described, you know I have a million questions about this childhood. And I'll just do a couple quick ones.
One is, what's one piece of wisdom you learned from a camel herding grandmother? Like, I don't understand the job of camel herding. That means helping the camels go where they need to be.
[Bulle]
Exactly.
[Neil]
Any wisdom from her that you remember or can share?
[Bulle]
What I've learned from her a lot is, and she used to tell us when we were young, is silence is golden. So she used to tell us to open our ears, our eyes, and try to remain silent. And remember, she never went to school as well.
She used to tell us that everywhere you go, try and you know, open your eyes, your ears, but keep your mouth shut. So if you can't keep your mouth shut, but try and reduce it. So use your eyes and ears more than your mouth.
So that's why you have one and the rest are two. Yeah. And the rest are two.
And she used to say that there's a reason why the ears are open, the eyes are open, and the mouth can be opened and closed. Yeah, so...
[Neil]
The ears are open.
[Bulle]
Yes. The eyes are open.
[Neil]
And the mouth... The nostrils are open. The nostrils are open.
Yes. But the mouth can close.
[Bulle]
Yes, it can open and can close. Right. So you have the choice to say something good or remain silent.
So she used to tell us in our own mother tongue, which is Somali, that silence is golden.
[Neil]
What's the Somali phrase?
[Bulle]
A closed mouth is gold. Af means mouth. Dabolon means a closed one.
[Neil]
Yes.
[Bulle]
And Dhab means gold. Wow. I love this.
So... I love this.
[Neil]
This is like...
[Bulle]
A closed mouth is gold. Wow. So she used to tell us that.
And one of the blessings she used to give us is... She used to tell us that when you travel to Nairobi or other parts or when you go to a foreign country, she used to tell us that may the people of that place be your brothers and sisters. So those are some of the blessings that...
[Neil]
May the people of that place be your brothers and sisters.
[Bulle]
Brothers and sisters and they take care of you and let their harm not harm you. Or if there's a harm in that environment. So those are some of the blessings that even still even my mom blesses us with.
So wherever you go, may God make those people that interact with be your brothers and sisters. Wow. If there's any harm or something, may God protect you against that harm.
So to some extent, they were spiritual. And all of them, they were not educated. So these are now knowledge they used to get from the animals.
These are knowledge they used to get from nature. So all of them, they lived with nature harmoniously. So it's sometimes...
Yes, there are some people who never went to school, but they carry a lot of wisdom. A lot of knowledge.
[Neil]
Absolutely.
[Bulle]
Because of how they interacted with the environment and animals and other things.
[Neil]
So the camels.
[Bulle]
A lot, yeah.
[Neil]
When they go to a different herd of camels. Now you're offering this brotherhood to people, the public. You have your doors open to the public here.
And a busy and it's an edgy street. There's a lot happening out there. You have to kind of keep your wits about you.
[Bulle]
And I've learned also a lot from how they used to use astronomy. With animals and also a camel. Every time there's a certain star that's linked to when to milk a camel.
Yeah, when to take them to their place, their homestead. So what a certain star means. So they used to have some ancient knowledge as they use the moon.
As they use the stars. What certain stars mean. Yeah, what clouds mean.
Where will you go to look for pasture? So, you know, she used to move with animals to look for water and pasture. So we come from an arid area.
So you have to seek and look for pasture for your animals. Water and grass. So they used to use a lot of stars.
They used to gaze at the stars and everything. As they now move from one area to another area. That is now knowledge and wisdom they just acquired from the environment and from animals.
From animals, yeah. So that's how I think a lot of ancient knowledge, I think, which we never documented. And that should be documented.
That our grandmothers, our great-grandfathers used to use it.
[Neil]
That's incredible. Yeah. But from a young age and through your childhood, you were taught that there's things a lot bigger than the mind. A lot of things out there that you can't articulate, that you can't see.
And then your second year of university, as you're going on to study to become a banker, you hit this book, The Power of the Subconscious Mind. So tell us about this book and what it did for you.
[Bulle]
So I've read a long time ago. Basically, the book is about how powerful subconscious mind is. And when you go to sleep, actually, we divide our life into eight hours.
That's three into three. Eight hours working, eight hours maybe committing or reading, whatever. And eight hours that we sleep.
So the most powerful eight hours is when we sleep. Yes, our soul leaves us. I don't know where it goes.
Maybe it graces. I don't know where. As we sleep, but our body and everything is working.
You're not conscious, but you are half dead, if I might call it. But you still, all your organs are functioning. It's as if you're fasting.
But all your organs are functioning well. So what is happening is...
[Neil]
You're fully living. Yes. That you have no awareness of this life.
[Bulle]
So sometimes you dream about something that maybe happens. Sometimes that will happen. There are those people who are good in interpreting dreams.
Personally, me, I'm not good at it. But now what your brain is doing is, the subconscious mind is, whatever you program it with during the day, if you're a positive person, if you do something good, that will be registered automatically into your subconscious mind. And I think some people say that our conscious brain is just 5%.
And 95% is unconscious. A lot of things that we do is done unconsciously without even knowing. Even now, me moving my hands is unconscious.
How our eyes move. Which means over 90%, 95% of our body is controlled by the subconscious. So the book talks about how you can tap into that subconscious brain and bring it into conscious or take advantage of it.
So one of it is visualization, how you can visualize something that you think over it over and over again about something. It's like practice, practice makes perfect. Yeah.
[Neil]
Or like the vision board idea.
[Bulle]
Yeah, exactly. So now where you visualize things that you will have a certain car, a certain house, a certain partner, or visualizing that your business will grow into certain things. And then now leave it with your subconscious brain now to make it happen.
So that the same way you unconsciously move your eyes and your hand and everything, and you walk and your organs work and we are not even aware. Our hearts beats, you're not aware. Your kidneys are functioning.
Your liver is functioning. So that's the subconscious mind that is doing it. So the book now talks about that, how you can visualize something.
Some other people say the law of attraction, how you can attract something to yourself. But now the power of subconscious mind is now tapping into your subconscious mind. So basically, sometimes they say that we are cosmologically blind or cosmologically unaware of a lot of things.
So whatever we see and whatever we think of most of the time is maybe 5% of what you should have. So 90% of what you should have achieved as human beings, we are yet to tap into that. So we are powerhouse, but we are unable to tap into that just because we are unable to tap into that subconscious mind.
So sometimes there's those people who are gifted, who can see with their eyes, multiple colors, multiple heights of something is how they open their eyes. Yeah, how they open their eyes. So the power of subconscious mind.
And I tested it when I used to work at the bank. I said, let me put it into test where I used to say that I will park tomorrow at certain spot. So sometimes I used to...
[Neil]
I'll park my car tomorrow at the second last spot in the corner. You say that in the bank, the day before. And the next day, without thinking about it, you would park in that spot.
So you would probably program or, not trick, but you're pre-planning because you know that at night, anything you take in during the day is going to be thought about, ruminated over, played upon.
[Bulle]
So your brain wakes you up at that time. You go to the shower. You do everything you want as quickly as possible.
And I don't know how the universe helps you with that. And then you end up parking in that spot.
[Neil]
Because we're cosmologically blind. And I have this feeling all the time where I think, oh, I have an important exam the next morning. I have to set my alarm for 5.30. And inevitably, I open my eyes, it's 5.29. My brain is just decided. It knows exactly when to wake up, a minute before you do. Everybody knows this feeling, right? Yes.
And this book, The Power of the Subconscious Mind. And by the way, our guest in Chapter 102 of the show, Jonathan Haidt, H-A-I-D-T, he wrote the book The Righteous Mind. He talks about it using the metaphor of the elephant and the rider.
We think that we are the rider on the elephant, but actually the vast, giant, moving animal underneath us is controlling our entire behavior, which is in this book. He also wrote The Anxious Generation, which is now a big hit.
[Bulle]
Yeah, I stock it, yeah. Yeah, you have it, you have it, I'm sure.
[Neil]
Yeah, exactly. So anything else that those listening, including me, can do to harness or enable or support our subconscious to help our lives? Anything else?
So visualization was one. Yes. Knowing that you will remember and kind of pre-program.
[Bulle]
Exactly, yeah.
[Neil]
Are you one of these people that keeps a dream diary or keeps a notebook right beside your bed before and after? Because I've heard that this is a tool some people use.
[Bulle]
No, I usually have my own notebook that I keep, but I don't have it next to my bed. The other thing after visualization is actualizing it, the actual part. So once you visualize something, you have to do something about it.
So I like the logo or the mantra of Nike, just do it. Just do it. Just do it.
So sometimes I think by not acting, we'll be losing a lot. So failure and trying, I think, is the key to success. So most of the time, yes, you have subconsciously programmed yourself.
The next thing is the action part. So you have visualized it. So you have to work towards it.
So even the law of attraction is good. You want to attract certain things, but you have to work towards that thing.
[Neil]
Yeah.
[Bulle]
Because the universe will not hand it over to you for free.
[Neil]
Right.
[Bulle]
You have to work for it.
[Neil]
There's a combined piece.
[Bulle]
Exactly.
[Neil]
There's the knowing what to do, and then there's the actual doing it.
[Bulle]
Exactly.
[Neil]
Failure and trying is the key to success. Just do it. By the way, we were talking about my book, The Happiness Equation.
This isn't an advertisement for my book. We were talking about it before we recorded, and I gave you a copy. And we were talking about it.
Two chapters in that book. One is about splitting your day into three eight-hour chunks, and the week into three. And I have a whole chapter on the Nike slogan, just do it, talking about how the company went from $800 million to $10 billion over the ducky, where they used that.
It's like you're quoting my book back to me without having read it. It's so interesting. Now, you're a second-year university.
You read this book. I can see how much of a difference it's made to you. Yeah, exactly.
You go become a banker. Yeah. How does a banker, because there's people listening that maybe dream about opening a bookstore.
But I'm sorry to say this, but I picture the banker profession being more lucrative. So I'm missing a big left turn here somehow. What happens?
[Bulle]
It's interesting. So when I was also in campus, before I joined in the campus, you know, employment, I used to be involved in small, small businesses that I used to run. I used to run a small shop in Nairobi where I used to sell fresh juice, so drinks.
[Neil]
Yeah, like passion fruit, tamarind, and all these things that you can only get here. Exactly. I had a tamarind juice today, and it was like, I said to the guy, this is better than any juice I've ever had in my life.
He said, take me back to Kando, Opa, the juice stand. I said, but I can't get the fresh fruit there.
[Bulle]
So I used to do, to make them. So the business never lasted close to a year. So it was less than, I think, 11 months.
After 11 months, I think I closed. And I had other businesses along the way. And then I got employed.
That's when I was in campus, when I was running those businesses. And then I got employed as an intern.
[Neil]
Okay, in Nairobi?
[Bulle]
In Nairobi, yeah. So in Kenya, you know, I don't know, maybe even maybe in Europe and in US and Canada. So here in Kenya, how it works is you go to school.
Once you're done with the school, you look for work.
[Neil]
Yeah.
[Bulle]
Exactly. So I started applying while I finished campus. Before, as I was waiting to graduate, I started applying for a job.
[Neil]
Yeah.
[Bulle]
So I started sending my CV. So I sent to UMREF. UMREF is a non-governmental organization.
I sent to another non-governmental organization. I think it was UNF or UNDP. I can't remember.
And then I sent to a bank. So bank was the last option. Yeah.
I've never thought of, you know, joining.
[Neil]
And your degree was in which area?
[Bulle]
Bachelor of Commerce.
[Neil]
Okay, so you're in business. Okay, so you can say I can qualify here. I've done some accounting classes.
[Bulle]
Yeah, I did actually accounting. The option was accounting. So I majored in accounting.
So, but I didn't want to go to bank in industry. So it was the last thing. So at that time, you know, the thing that was liberative was to go to non-governmental organization, NGOs.
[Neil]
NGOs.
[Bulle]
Yeah.
[Neil]
Non-governmental organization.
[Bulle]
Exactly. So luckily, the bank called me.
[Neil]
Not the NGOs, they didn't call you.
[Bulle]
Yeah, they didn't call me. So the bank called me and told me, I told them I haven't finished yet. I'm graduating in six, seven months.
No, they told me, it's okay. Bring your papers. We'll take you as an intern.
Wow. So I worked there for seven months. After seven months, when I graduated, they gave me full-time employment.
[Neil]
And this is like, I want to say like 2005, 2006?
[Bulle]
That's 2009.
[Neil]
2009, okay.
[Bulle]
So I graduated in 2010 August. Okay. So 2010 August, when I graduated, they fully employed me as a full-time employee.
Ah. So I was supposed to become a salesperson at a branch. Yeah.
In Nairobi.
[Neil]
Yeah.
[Bulle]
But later on, I ended up in the finance department.
[Neil]
So you're in the finance department of a bank.
[Bulle]
Yes.
[Neil]
I'm still missing the bookstore part.
[Neil]
This sounds like a good job. You're happy.
[Bulle]
So I went to the finance. Yeah. Helping with reports and something of the sorts.
And then later on, I was moved, 10, 9 months later, I was moved to credit department. Now the loaning part. So that's where I think almost seven and a half years of my life in the banking was.
So I used to give a lot of loans to, I used to lend on behalf of the bank. So I started an officer. When I left employment, I was a manager, a credit manager, giving big loans to big companies in Kenya, including Kenya Airways.
Big mall.
[Neil]
Which I flew here on.
[Bulle]
Yeah. We also took part. I took part in financing one of the biggest mall in Kenya, Two Rivers, and many other real estate companies.
[Neil]
You're really neck deep in this.
[Bulle]
Yes. You're a banker. Exactly.
So now 2015, at that time, I was also running some other businesses. So in 2011, I was involved in other businesses. I was also into the spare parts and car spare parts and rims and tires.
I used to sell those stuff, car accessories. So it didn't do well. And then I opened the first online store for selling car accessories and car spare parts.
So it didn't do well because I was half in. So it didn't do well. I opened, I employed a couple of guys.
They were not doing good sales and selling is hard. So then I took what I call it business sabbatical. So I took a break from business.
[Neil]
Business?
[Bulle]
Sabbatical. Sabbatical.
[Neil]
Yeah.
[Bulle]
So that is 2014.
[Neil]
You're like, enough of this. I'm taking a break. But you're still working as a banker.
[Bulle]
Yeah, I'm still in the bank, but I took a break from business. That's 2014, 2015. That's now when I started immersing myself into books.
So one good year. So I used to read four to five books every month. So close to 50 books every year.
Though in 2011, when I graduated 2010, 2011, 2013, I did my master's. So master's in strategic management. So I went back to school a few months after I graduated.
I did my undergrad. So while I was doing my MBA, that's also when I started loving books. At that time, I was doing my MBA and also running my businesses and started reading books.
So along the way in 2014, that's after I graduated with my first master's. That's when I left now doing business. And I said, let me take a break.
Maybe all this business didn't work. So I need to reflect. So now that's when I started getting involved into books.
[Neil]
Is that when you started the bookstore?
[Bulle]
Not yet. So when I started reading books, I used to take books to my workplace. So we used to have between 30 to one hour lunch break.
So at that time, I used to read my book for 15 minutes, 20 minutes to read the book on my free time. So my colleagues used to see me carrying books and reading books. And they used to borrow books from me.
They used to tell me, oh, I would love to have this book. Can I read? So once I finish, I will give it to them.
I'll give it to them. So I used to have a deskmate who was a lady who was a close friend of mine. She's called Jackie.
And she told me, and she saw me giving books for a couple of months. She told me, why can't you sell books to us? Why are you gifting us books?
Sell it to me at a fee. Ah, I said, this is an opportunity. Why can't I get them?
[Neil]
People want books and there isn't anywhere to get them.
[Bulle]
Exactly. Then I thought about it. I said, I'm failing these businesses.
So what is the approach I can use to get into the go-to-market approach? What can I do? So at that time, we didn't have a lot of e-commerces.
That's 2015. So we only had, I think, two or three companies that were doing e-commerce or online. Online sale of items.
But they were selling other products, not books. So I said, oh, there's an opportunity here. So my go-to-market will be an online sale of books.
I will be selling books online and open a small store, but I will be delivering to customers. So 2015, December, I opened a Facebook page, started selling books. The same year, we opened our first website and I started selling books.
Later on, the website crashed in January. And then I looked for a developer again. He developed it for me again.
What was the bookstore called? Nuria. Where'd you come up with the name?
It's coincidence. Initially, I wanted to call it Jua. J-U-A.
So Jua means to know in Swahili. It can also mean the sun, sun. So it can mean light.
It can also mean to know in Swahili. Perfect. Yeah.
And the guy who was designing for me the logo, when I gave him the name, he told me it doesn't look good. So think about another name.
[Neil]
Because the logo didn't look good.
[Bulle]
Yes, exactly. So...
[Neil]
He said, okay, I'll get a new logo guy.
[Bulle]
No, no, no. So he was a brilliant gentleman. So he used to specialize in designing logos and doing graphics.
And there were not many at that time.
[Neil]
Yeah. You had to stick with that guy. He said he doesn't like the name.
So he said, get a new one. So then you picked N-U-R-I-A, Nuria Books. Exactly.
[Bulle]
The reason is, one, Nuria is a Spanish name, Arabic name, and also Somalis use it. So it comes from the word in the Swahili context, from the word nuru or nur. Nur is Arabic.
Nuru is a Swahili, which is light, which means light. So Nuria means light, the one that gives light. So and my mom also, her name is Nuria.
[Neil]
Your mom's name is Nuria. So the name of the bookstore is light in three languages. Exactly.
And it's your mom's name. Exactly. And the logo guy approved it.
Yes. He's like, I can make this one into a good logo. And I'm looking at the logo right now.
It's got, you've got, I mean, we'll have to flash it on the screen right now, but it's got like a green triangle, a little... That is N. Oh, that's the N.
Yeah, that's N. Okay. And it's like in the colors, I'm assuming, like the Kenyan color.
[Bulle]
Yeah, the green, yes. And then the black and the white. There's a lot of green in this country.
[Neil]
The ecology is green. Bonnie's presidential campaign stickers I've got. There's green everywhere.
[Bulle]
We love green. They love green.
[Neil]
In the Western world, there's hardly any green. Look at the flags of Canada, the United States. There's no green.
[Bulle]
Oh, there's no green, yeah.
[Neil]
They don't have green on anything. Green is like a sub-color. Yes.
Here, it's the lead color. Nuria Books launched as a Facebook page. You had demand from people that you were lending books to.
It starts to organically build up. You think of a go-to-market strategy because you've done an MBA, so you've got this business brain on it. But you're still working as a banker?
Correct. And at some point, I'm assuming... Yes.
...you read...
[Bulle]
The Why Nation's Fail, yeah.
[Neil]
Is this a formative book for you? Yes. And can you hold it up to the camera so people can see if they're watching?
So you're in your 20s?
[Bulle]
Now, at that time, I'm in mid-20s.
[Neil]
You're mid-20s? Yeah, exactly. You got the banking job.
You've got this organic book thing happening. Yes, yes. How do you come across this book, and what does it do for you?
[Bulle]
This book, I started reading, I think, in my late 20s. I think 30.
[Neil]
Late 20s.
[Bulle]
When I was 30, I think.
[Neil]
Why Nation's Fail by Darren... And James. Darren James.
Darren Asimoglu, A-C-E-M-O-G-L-U. And James A. Robinson.
And it says around the front, it won the Nobel Prize.
[Bulle]
Yes.
[Neil]
The Origins of Power, Prosperity, and Poverty. Yes. So take us into your life and tell us what this book did for you.
[Bulle]
This book, I think, spoke to me deeply. I think it was in my early 30s. It spoke to me because of how they compare societies that live together.
How some flourishing, or some are wealthy, and some are poor to the extreme. So both of them, they give an example, I think, in South Africa, where there is one side of South Africans who are wealthy, and maybe divided by a road, or maybe divided by a wall. On the other side, some are so poor.
They can't even get a dollar or two dollars a day. And the other side, they are so wealthy and flourishing. So he compares, actually, both of them, they look at why some got it right, some nations, and some didn't get it right.
[Neil]
By the way, in Canada, the richest postal code in the whole country, which is Rosedale in Toronto, is touching the poorest postal code in the whole country, which is Regent Park. They actually are touching in Toronto, which is richest and poorest in the whole Canada. Yes.
Sounds like similar there. Similar. And he goes into why that is.
Why is that?
[Bulle]
I don't know. Is it because of how capital is structured? Is it because of capitalism?
Is it because of greed? I don't know. I think maybe someone needs to study human beings, how I think we operate.
So this one, these are now slums. This is a picture of a slum.
[Neil]
Ah, the picture on the front.
[Bulle]
Yes.
[Neil]
I wonder which country that is.
[Bulle]
It must be, I think, South African.
[Neil]
Okay, because that's what he's talking about.
[Bulle]
But also compared locally here in Kenya, there's a place called Mudaiga, which most of the rich or some of the rich Kenyans live. Yeah. And on the other side, which is close to their name, it's called Madare, just a road that divides them, people who are poor live on the other side.
If you go to Kibra and Karen, K, K, this other side is M, M, Madare, Mudaiga. This other side is Kibera and Karen. So on the other side of the road, people who are wealthy, on this other side, people who are extremely poor.
So each nation have such. So they compare.
[Neil]
This is interesting.
[Bulle]
Yeah, it is.
[Neil]
It's very interesting. They show off, based on 15 years of research, the authors show that it is our man-made political and economic institutions that underlie economic success or lack of it. Korea, to take just one example, is a remarkably homogenous nation, yet the people of North Korea are among the poorest on earth, while their brothers and sisters in South Korea are among the richest.
The difference is between the Koreas is due to the politics that created those two different institutional trajectories. So do you think about this? Like you're running a communal space.
Yeah. You have a door open policy here. You have over 2,000 self-published authors who sell their books through your website.
[Bulle]
Yeah.
[Neil]
At www.
[Bulle]
NuriaKenya.com.
[Neil]
NuriaKenya.com.
[Bulle]
Go to it.
[Neil]
N-U-R-I-A-K-E-N-Y-A dot com. And you're doing very well, because you have opened multiple stores. Correct.
So you figured something out here, economically.
[Bulle]
Yeah. 2016, actually, I onboarded five Kenyan authors, and I saw, besides taking advantage of the online presence, I also saw an opportunity where self-published authors or independent authors were not accommodated by local bookstores at that time. Yeah.
[Neil]
Because they go through the big publishers, and they don't publish the African authors.
[Bulle]
Yes. If you are nobody, and you have written a book, you wouldn't have a place to take your book. So I became housing such books.
So I started housing such books. So one of the things, challenges, the first was the bookstores that were in Kenya at that time were thinking of the shelf space. So why will I put your book that's not selling, and it will occupy my shelf space?
So they were looking from the economic side, but they were not looking at it from the angle of supporting the local authors, the social aspect, and also uplifting other authors. So many authors came from humble backgrounds, and there are many that were rejected, including J.K. Rowling. Yeah.
Including, I think, is it John Grisham? I don't know which other author. Yeah.
That was rejected by publishers.
[Neil]
Tim Ferriss had 17 rejected before the four-hour workweek.
[Bulle]
So me, I said, I will not reject any author.
[Neil]
I will not reject any author.
[Bulle]
Yeah. I won't.
[Neil]
Even if the book doesn't sell.
[Bulle]
Exactly.
[Neil]
There are some of the 2,000 people that have self-published books with you, with your platform, who have never sold a single copy.
[Bulle]
We still sell the books, but even if the book doesn't perform, we will not turn down. Oh, I see. We will stock the book. And thereby— I will help them on how to sell. We will guide them. We'll coach them.
We'll teach them on how it works and how to sell. So we guide them. So we will help them.
Many authors, we have some authors who are as young as seven, six years old, who were brought to us by their parents, so who had the gift of writing, and the parents helped them to write the books. So if we will say no to such author, so that will be now— wouldn't be fair to them.
[Neil]
You're creating a reading culture. Exactly. In a country which, sorry to ask you this, does it have one already?
[Bulle]
Like, what's the— The reading culture is peaking, but it's not as good as other markets outside Africa. But we are number three in Africa in terms of readership. After?
After Nigeria and South Africa.
[Neil]
Those are the top two.
[Bulle]
Yes, Nigeria is because of the population. Measured by percentage of total book sales. Yes, sales and readership.
Ah. And also population. So Nigeria is because of the— Yeah, like six times the population.
And also, the other thing that contributes to the book sales in Africa is the purchasing power of that country. So South Africa is fairly close to our population, if not more, in terms of population-wise. But the readership is high because of the— the purchasing power is high in South Africa compared to Kenya.
Right.
[Neil]
People on the other side of the road. Yes. They can buy a lot of books.
[Bulle]
Exactly. And they have more wealthy people than us, as Kenyans. So that's why you see a lot of billionaires from Africa, from South Africa and Nigeria.
Yes. Because of the whites in South Africa, they're billionaires, most of them. Especially the ones who run businesses there.
Yeah, of course.
[Neil]
Of course.
[Bulle]
So you— Not all of them, but a handful of them.
[Neil]
Did you just quit your job then? Or did you just let it be a slow trickle away? And they're like, hey, where's this guy?
Where's Bulle on Friday afternoons? And hey, I saw him on Saturday. He's also running a bookstore.
[Bulle]
So the thing that happened was interesting. It's as if the universe was trying to help me get out of employment.
[Neil]
Or your subconscious.
[Bulle]
I don't know. So in 2016, April, the bank I was working with was put under receivership.
[Neil]
The bank went bankrupt?
[Bulle]
Yes, exactly. Because of some kind of insider dealings that the shareholders or the owners were doing. So the Central Bank of Kenya moved in and put that bank under receivership.
And later on sold the license to another bank called Mauritius Bank. It's called SBM. It's from Mauritius.
So the license was transferred and the asset was given to SBM Bank. For two good years, we did transfer of assets from this bank to the other. So basically, they bidded, blah, blah.
And then later on, they sold— But the bank went bankrupt.
[Neil]
Yes. Thereby pushing you, accelerating you into this business that you started. Is it going okay?
Is it going well? I mean, Bonnie says this is the best bookstore in the whole country. I see the ratings online.
And the reviews are unbelievable. For those that haven't checked it out, go to check the reviews. It's like everyone's raving about your bookstore.
You have a second location now in Mombasa.
[Bulle]
Yes, yes.
[Neil]
And you're in your early 40s now, if I'm wrong.
[Bulle]
Yeah, we are 40s now.
[Neil]
Happy 41st, I think-ish, right?
[Bulle]
Yes, yes.
[Neil]
Because I knew, because my wife just celebrated her 40th, and it was 1985.
[Neil]
Exactly.
[Neil]
I had a trick, because I knew you were one year earlier. Yes. And you're running this bookstore.
Culture's here. Yes. So, our listenership's all over.
How do you help people orient themselves in African literature, African books? And I'm asking for myself, too. Only a couple months ago, I realized, I don't think I've read a single book from Africa.
Other than Bonny's, I haven't read a single book from this country. I've heard of some out of Africa. Now, I've got Dance of the Jacaranda by Peter Kamini.
I just read Weep Not Child.
[Bulle]
Child by Ngugi. Ngugi.
[Neil]
But help us. So, for those that are listening to this, that are looking for a bookseller like you, who's running a thriving bookstore, where do we start?
[Bulle]
Because what we did when we realized in 2016, when we onboarded five independent authors, the readership was poor. And I think this was because of how our environment shaped us. So, our environment is a bit different and interesting, especially in Africa and also in Kenya.
Say more, yeah. Because when you go to school, you read to pass exam. You don't read for leisure or you don't read to better your life.
Everything revolves around passing exams so that you become a better person. So, you're forced to read books. So, you're forced to memorize.
And then when it comes to exams, you put them down into the paper. So, you see both in high school and in primary school, you see that as a punishment.
[Neil]
Yeah, I was just thinking that. Punishment was the word I was thinking of.
[Bulle]
Exactly.
[Neil]
Reading is something you have to do, you're forced to do, and you're told what to read.
[Bulle]
You're forced to go to school. Exactly. Because of that, once you finish university, nobody wants to see books.
Because you look back and say that, ah, no.
[Neil]
It's like seeing a pencil case or a homework.
[Bulle]
Exactly. Because of that now, people don't tend to read, especially here in Kenya and Africa. So now, the second thing you think about is once you finish university is you start looking for work.
Your first priority is where will I find one job? So, book will be the list of things that you're thinking about. So, yours is how can I find a job?
How can I find a girlfriend and marry her and start building my own family? How will I get a car? How will I build a house?
So, book is the list of all priorities. So, it took us many years of marketing so that at least we remind Kenyans that for you to be a better person, you must start reading. So, self-development, which is...
[Neil]
The exception in the story, sir.
[Bulle]
Exactly. So, one of the key things we used to push for it was build yourself personally. And the only way you can build yourself is through books.
[Neil]
You market this online.
[Bulle]
Exactly. Self-education.
That's what we should say. Self-education. The other one was forced education.
The other one was forced knowledge. The one for schools. You're forced because you go to school to pass.
You're not there to better yourself. So, you must become... You must get a good GPA score.
You must pass exams. You must... Everything is pass, pass, pass, pass.
Nothing involves you as the person. So, now what we started pitching or marketing is around you now. Be a better version of yourself.
Go read. Self-education. Go learn and learn and relearn.
So, that's what...
[Neil]
You start with the self-help side. That's why on your shelves I saw Start With Why by Simon Sinek. I saw Gabor Mate's book.
I think you sell a lot of Atomic Habits as everybody does. It's sold 25 million copies. And so, is there African self-help authors that we should be thinking about reading?
Yeah, we do. I see there's a display right here, by the way. I walk in.
It says Bestsellers. Selected using sales reigns on Nuria.com. And there's a pile here saying The Fight For Order.
[Bulle]
There's a new book. So, we displayed it here because he released it two days ago.
[Neil]
Okay, this is a new. And then on top of it is Preserving Marriage Institutions with a husband and wife at their wedding with their faces covered by leaves. What's this one about?
[Bulle]
I know there's a lady also. She brought them today. So, we put just to promote her.
[Neil]
Okay, but help me. So, I'm understanding the path that you're on both as a country and as a bookstore and as a reading culture nation in terms of teaching people and reminding people that books can be a pleasure device, not just a force device. You're using self-help as the bridge to that. And then for people outside of this continent, do you want to read more African writers?
[Bulle]
We have, because initially when we started, we started stocking Kenyan books.
[Neil]
Yeah.
[Bulle]
Because it was within reach. Yeah. It was easy.
They can find us and we can sell those books. Later on, as we do a lot of marketing on social media and on our platforms, more self-help authors outside Kenya started reaching out to us from Zambia, South Africa, Nigeria, Uganda, Tanzania. So, now we have over 35 African authors outside Kenya.
[Neil]
Oh, wow.
[Bulle]
Yeah. And we have another five from outside Africa.
[Neil]
And people are finding books that they love here.
[Bulle]
Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. And also, we ship. You know, Neil, the other thing also we do is we ship to the rest of the world.
Right. We use DHL and FedEx and UPS.
[Neil]
You're an entrepreneur.
[Bulle]
You figured out a million ways to do it. Exactly. So, we partnered with DHL on how we can ship books outside Africa.
In Canada, you can get it within two or three days, maximum.
[Neil]
Really? Yeah. Two or three days?
[Bulle]
Three days, yeah.
[Neil]
From here?
[Bulle]
From here to Canada is two or three days.
[Neil]
It took me two or three days to get here.
[Bulle]
Exactly. So, we use DHL. We have partnership with them.
And then we ship books everywhere on this planet Earth. The farthest, which is the most expensive one, are New Zealand and Australia.
[Neil]
Yeah, of course.
[Bulle]
Those are the two countries.
[Neil]
They're far from everywhere.
[Bulle]
Exactly. So, those are only two countries, I think. It's a bit steep when it comes to sending books.
[Neil]
And it's working. And this business is profitable. You're opening a second location.
You recommend book selling to people. Any advice for people that want to open a bookstore? Daydreamers that are out there thinking that they want to do this?
[Bulle]
They can do it, but it needs a lot of patience. It needs consistency. And it needs a lot of marketing.
Yeah, you must make noise about it.
[Neil]
How do you do this marketing? I don't see any bookstore marketing in my life.
[Bulle]
Us, we market a lot.
[Neil]
Instagram?
[Bulle]
All social medias. No, we do organic most of the time. 90% of our posts and marketing are organic.
[Neil]
I saw when I came here, you had over 16,000 followers on Instagram. And I saw that you had over three Instagram posts in the last four hours.
[Bulle]
Correct.
[Neil]
Meanwhile, you're running a store. So something's going on here.
[Bulle]
So every day we do 20 posts across all platforms. We do Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, and TikTok. That's like a full-time job.
Yeah, it is. How we structured our team is everyone has access to our social media accounts. Everybody?
Everybody.
[Neil]
Oh, and anybody can post anything anytime.
[Bulle]
You create content and then post.
[Neil]
Wow, what a great philosophy.
[Bulle]
Yeah, so everyone has access to it. A couple of years, we went for training on Facebook. One of my colleagues went for training on Facebook on how to post and how to schedule posts.
Later on, I realized that we shouldn't follow the policies of how to post, when to post. They will tell you this is the right time to post for Kenyans. This is the right time to post for this.
So because of the number of posts and the number of information that are shared on platform, you cannot structure posting unless you're creating a video. But normal posts, we went against the tide, against the normal, where you're supposed to post at 10 a.m. This is when all Kenyans or maybe 70% of Kenyans have access to internet. Maybe some of them, they are at workplace.
Maybe they're accessing. They have access to free internet. So a few years ago, it was like that.
But nowadays, access of internet is high. So people can easily buy data. So we said that we should not be following that structure.
So what we'll be doing is we will post as and when we have content that's ready. Because billions and billions of posts are shared every minute, every second. So if you say, I will post only two, it will be swallowed by the other posts.
[Neil]
That's all I'm doing. I'm doing like one post every three, four days. This is my problem.
[Bulle]
No, maybe it's better because maybe you have good following. But when you are growing and growing organically and you don't have a lot of following. Yeah.
So the best way to catch up or to compliment or to... Never stop yelling. Exactly.
[Neil]
Go, go, go, go, go. And it takes time and it takes patience.
[Bulle]
A lot of patience.
[Neil]
And then sometimes... You're open seven days a week too. You're working hard.
[Bulle]
We started accommodating opening on Sundays two years ago. And the reason why we did was there were some customers who asked us, who were asking us, do you open on Sundays? Do you guys open on Sundays?
So we started collecting that data. So there were not many. So we said that let's open for half day on Sundays.
So we work full day from Monday to Saturday and then half day on Sunday. And then Sunday all became now a normal day. Almost become a normal day.
It's not a normal person, but normal. So there are some of customers who come. Reason why they do that is because there's less traffic.
And parking on Sundays in Nairobi CBD is free or in Nairobi. But you pay for parking from Monday to Saturday. So of course, also it's shaped by the...
[Neil]
Free parking, less traffic. Exactly. I've been in the traffic already.
I've been here one day. I know what you mean. There's a lot of traffic.
[Bulle]
So the decision was shaped by the pain. Yeah. And the opportunity.
[Neil]
And you're listening to your people.
[Bulle]
Exactly. And then that is now how, you know. And then we started now having events, in-store events.
Yeah, we have in-store events here. Like what? This lady, we hosted her.
[Neil]
You're pointing. You're pointing at a wall. There's a woman, she's in a dress, holding a giant white circle.
What is that?
[Bulle]
That's called nyatiti. It's like guitar, but it's not guitar. Okay.
So it's a traditional...
[Neil]
You hosted her in the store.
[Bulle]
So this lady visited Kenya like 20 years ago. She went to a county called Siaya.
[Neil]
Yeah.
[Bulle]
She lived there for 20 years. Yep. She learned how to play that equivalent of guitar.
It's called nyatiti.
[Neil]
Yeah.
[Bulle]
She's an expert in that. And she became the first female to play that guitar, that nyatiti.
[Neil]
Really?
[Bulle]
Yes. She's the first female to play that.
[Neil]
Oh, wow.
[Bulle]
She was here last week.
[Neil]
And Yango, you're Siaya. Nyatiti Queen. Yes.
Okay. Can we take this?
[Bulle]
Yes, yes, yes.
[Neil]
Okay, I'm going to buy this book. I'm going to buy a few books before I leave here.
[Bulle]
No, we will gift you some. No, no, no.
[Neil]
I'm buying. I'm supporting the bookstore.
[Bulle]
Actually, this book we played at...
[Neil]
As long as it's in English, I can read it. That's the only thing.
[Bulle]
We are the main distributors. Oh, you're writing the inside cover.
[Neil]
Yeah, she... That's thin. So I like this for my suitcase.
[Bulle]
She did it in Japanese in her mother's time. And also now it's in English. And she launched it a week ago.
Wow. And she did a book reading here.
[Neil]
You're right immersed in it. You got authors coming in now. You must be working around the clock here.
[Bulle]
Yeah, we have a lot of authors who visit us outside Africa. She visited us this year. Last year, we hosted seven international authors outside Africa.
Also, we take part in festivals. There's one that ended called Macondo Festival. Hopefully, we might invite you one of these days.
Oh, yeah. Yeah.
[Neil]
I'm looking for an excuse to come back already.
[Bulle]
Exactly. So that festival basically is a fusion of international authors and Kenyan authors. Yeah.
So it happens every September on 20th and 21st. You got a lot going on. So one of these days, we'll invite you so that at least you become a speaker.
[Neil]
I would love that.
[Bulle]
They usually take care of everything. They stay here.
[Neil]
You get here on Kenyan Airlines.
[Bulle]
Exactly.
[Neil]
So we want to wrap things up here with Bule, the bookseller, who's given us a couple formative books so far, but also told us your inspiring journey and story from coming from Wajir.
[Bulle]
Is that right? Yeah, very correct.
[Neil]
Is that right? 700 kilometers northeast of here near the Somalian-Ethiopian borders, raised by your camel-herding grandmother and father with 14 brothers and sisters and both of your mom and dad's eyes. Yes.
Right? Yes. Coming up, learning how to be a baker and running a thriving bookstore, two of them.
[Bulle]
Yes.
[Neil]
And I'm going to Mombasa from here, by the way. So maybe I'll go to your other store.
[Bulle]
Hopefully. I'll visit us. Karibu.
[Neil]
And we also have a mutual friend going for president in 2027. Our guest in Chapter 104, Boniface Mwangi. So what role can bookstores like yours play in the advancement of culture and politics, do you think, in this country?
Where does this country need to go? And then let's wrap things up from there.
[Bulle]
That's a hard question. I think books play a vital key in shaping humanity in every angle. If you look at some of the people, the richest people on the planet, they were all shaped by books.
Bill Gates, Steve Jobs, Elon Musk. Most of them, they had fond of reading books. That's what I was talking about earlier was seeking self-knowledge, where you find yourself and see how you can help.
So books, literature and everything. Actually, even here in Africa, it helped a lot. There were many in our earlier years, people couldn't talk about or couldn't challenge the government.
So they used to put it in books, into books, either plays or fictions or in poetry, where they address what was affecting the society. So books tend to talk or convey the pains and the aspirations of the society. So it's not only, I think, even in Africa, we look at also what Dostoyevsky and all those guys wrote.
So, or Friedrich Nietzsche, all those. So they wrote about the society, how we can change, how. So they challenged the status quo and also sometimes gave solutions of how the society should be treated and how society look like.
So books does play a key role in that, not only in preserving, but also in advancing societies. So besides the school books, which I think schools, their work is to shape you to become a worker. But other books, the non-academic books, shape you to become a better human being, a better person.
So that's the difference between school books and general books.
[Neil]
Yeah, a better human being and a better person. Going from cosmologically blind to cosmologically aware, building on the power of your subconscious mind, using things like visualization, understanding what leads to things like nations failing and businesses booming. Bulle, the bookseller, thank you so much for coming on.
[Bulle]
Thanks for coming.
[Neil]
This has been a real joy. I really love talking to you.
[Bulle]
You're most welcome. And this is your home, visit us. And I want to say thanks to your mom as well, for being a Kenyan.
So you're half Kenyan, basically. Yes, I've become myself this way.
[Neil]
Now for coming here, I'm telling you, I'm going to be back here.
[Bulle]
We invite everyone. I think Kenya will be a big nation. Just near future.
We are not far from becoming a powerful nation sooner or later. We have brilliant people here in Kenya. Very brilliant people.
And Kenya is now like, let me say, the US of Africa to most African nations. Tanzanians rely on Kenyans. Ugandans rely on Kenyans.
Congolese, all Somalia, Ethiopia, they see Kenya like US to them. Because our currency is stronger, our economy is free. Nobody cares about what you do as long as you are not harming them.
You can successfully run a business here if you're a foreigner, as long as you're not breaking any law. And that's how I think the US was built. Now that's how Kenya has been built.
So it's a platform where you can come and plug and play if you follow the norms and the laws of this country. Anyone can become successful and do a lot of stuff. Welcome to Kenya.
Welcome to Nuria.
[Neil]
Wow, Nuria Books. Make sure you go follow Nuria Books online. www.nuriakenya.com Shipping in two or three days anywhere around the world. I know you're advertising on social media. Is it at Nuria Books?
[Bulle]
Our Instagram is Nuria underscore The Honest Store. We used to call ourselves The Honest Store. Now we are called The Home of African Books or Independent Authors.
Our Twitter is Nuria at Nuria Store and at Nuria Books. We have two handles. That's at Nuria Store at Nuria Books.
On TikTok is at Nuria Store. And on Facebook is Nuria Your Store. And Nuria Your Store.
So that's our Facebook page as well.
[Neil]
And I'm about to buy a whole bunch of books for you in the show notes. And in the end notes, I will share which books I've bought that I'm bringing home. And please support this store, support Independent Books or support the Kenyan growing, thriving, profiting economy.
And vote Boniface Mwangi 2027.
[Bulle]
Thank you, sir. Thank you. Thanks for coming in.
[Neil]
Thank you for having me. OK, what a joy and pleasure it's been. Hey, everybody, it's just me, just Neil again, back in my basement with my bag of wires, listening back to that wonderful conversation on the hot streets with passion fruit juice everywhere.
The smell of the kind of breeze there. You know, the sun hits you different in Kenya, I found. It's like it's not scorching.
It's not sweltering. It's like just this beautiful, warm sun. It's where we're from, right?
The cradle of humanity, as Peter Comande said in our last chapter of three books. Thank you so much for listening to Bule, the bookseller, who gave us so many little bits of advice, such as I find his thoughts really interesting. Like you can visualize something that you think over and over again and then leave it with your subconscious brain to make it happen.
First of all, I love the philosophy of this because it feels like very relieving. And also, in general, in life, I'm always looking for ways to let go of my mind, stop gripping the wheel too tightly, as my friend Mel Robbins would say. You know, when she started her TV show, we were all so excited for her.
And she was very excited too. And then she said, I just don't want to grip the wheel too tight in case it fails. Like, I don't want my whole persona to be resting on this.
Sure enough, it did fail, not because of her. I think there was pandemic issues and so on. And now today, she's kind of doing the same thing on a bigger scale with her podcast and her book, The Let Them Theory.
But my point is, the subconscious mind is going to do a lot of the work. It's the same idea with writing down goals or creating a vision board. I think for me, while those things, you wonder, like, does writing down goals work?
Well, yeah, it's proven to work. Does making a vision board work? Well, it depends what you believe.
But both of them are doing the same thing, which is creating new neural pathways that help you towards a specific goal. I think for anything really important in my life, I truthfully have written it down. You know, whether that's the contracts that I have with Leslie on things like Nights Away From Home or Mountain Days I'm Going to Travel.
Like, without writing it down, it's not really a legit thing. It's sort of ethereal and ephemeral, and it can shift. But when you write it down and we sort of sign it and think about it, it makes it real.
I think the subconscious mind's involved there. All right, that was one quote I expanded. I know that failure and trying is the key to success.
Sounds simple, but just remember, the more you fail, the more you try, the more you learn. No matter what it is in life you're trying to do, if you're sucking at it right now, you're learning. Like me, I signed up for hockey, okay?
I signed up for hockey. I've never played hockey before. I'm playing hockey on Wednesday nights now.
Every time I go, I am by far and away the worst player on the team. It's an over 45 league. I'm 46.
However, almost everyone in the league is like 65. But they're really good. They're good 65-year-olds.
And I'm like, I'm terrible. I'm the worst. But then I think I'm there for learning the most.
You know, I'm learning a sport that I've never played before. So failure and trying is the key to success. And then how about this?
He had a lot of comments about this. I think books play a vital role in shaping humanity, right? Bookstores play a key role in advancing society.
It's kind of like Peter's point in the last chapter where he says, even the greatest societies ever in human civilization, all we have to document them are their words, their stories. And so, so steadfast is Boulay's belief in the power of books and the power of reading that he's let go of, you know, a high finance job or career path in order to start and spread books. I was able to connect Boulay afterwards with James Daunt, the CEO of Barnes & Noble.
And credit to James Daunt, Boulay asked me if I could connect him. And I was like, well, I'll give it a shot. So I emailed James Daunt.
He's like, yes, I'd love to talk to him. And then Boulay sent me notes. I made a great conversation.
He gave me lots of tips and ideas for how to grow my independent bookstore in Africa. So here's James Daunt, you know, the head of Waterstones and Barnes & Noble and Daunt Books, taking time out of his schedule to like help Boulay. I mean, I think there's a love affair amongst book people globally.
That's why you're here right now. That's why I'm here right now. We love books.
We love books. We fall out of them sometimes. We get into, you know, we get into like quicksand sometimes, but we love books.
And thank you so much to Boulay, the bookseller, for adding a couple more books to our top 1000. I didn't get three this time. That's not me.
It was a lot happening that night. We were wandering around the bookstore. We're trying to find books.
I'm trying to get the story. I'm making up the questions. I'm like, but we got two.
We got two. We're going to add number 550, The Power of Your Subconscious Mind by Joseph Murphy, M-U-R-P-H-Y, which I, by the way, have on my bookshelf as well. I flipped through it a little bit.
It is a great book. And I've been fascinated by this in general since I was a kid, is the idea that there's a lot more mind than we use in general. So how do you use it?
Channeling it, guiding it. I think what you do right when you go to bed and right when you wake up are really important. That's kind of where two-minute evenings, you know, play Rose, Rose, Thorn, Bud before bed, and two-minute mornings, right?
I will let go of, I am grateful for, I will focus on. The reason I do those two practices at the end and the beginning of every day is because I think I want to kind of feed that sleeping mind a little more. Okay, and then we're also going to add number 549, Why Nations Fail by Darren Acemoglu, A-C-E-M-O-G-L-U, and James A.
Robinson. Two more books that we're going to add to the top 1,000. Thank you so much to Bule.
Thanks so much to Perlexi. Thanks so much to Boniface Mwangi. Thanks so much for people having me over in Africa.
I hope I brought some color and community over from Africa, over to wherever you are listening. Thank you all so much for listening to chapter 155 of three books. Are you still here?
Did you make it past the three-second pause? If so, I want to welcome you back to the end of the podcast club, one of the three clubs that we have for three books listeners. As if you're listening here, give us a call, 1-833-READALOT, R-E-A-D-A-L-O-T.
Give me your thoughts. Give me your voice notes. I love hearing from you.
Let's start off as we always do by going to the phones.
[Pheobe]
Hi, Neil. This is Phoebe from Charlotte, North Carolina. It's funny.
I love typing in the 1-833-READALOT because my muscle memory kicks in with the numbers and the letters. I just finished the episode with Robin Sloan, and I just have to say the best part of that episode was just the end bit where you're talking because, man, oh, man, I have been listening to this podcast since chapter one, and I could not make it through some of it. He was just rattling on.
My God, it was very funny that when you had to cut it off, thank you at the end. It's this outro music. You just had to cut him off because he just keeps on going, and he was doing something with his saliva.
I don't know. Whatever. And then the quotes that you picked out were like the only tolerable moments of him talking.
Sorry, this is not very complimentary about him. I don't know him, and I've never heard of him before, but I don't know. I couldn't help myself.
And then you were like, oh, well, please call in. This is the push. And I was like, okay, well, I'm doing it.
All right. Well, anyway, thanks. Love this podcast.
Part of all of the different clubs. Appreciate you. Have a good one.
[Neil]
Thank you so much to Phoebe from Charlotte for the honest and unfiltered review of Conversation with Robin Sloan. It's nice to hear calls like that because you never know what works, what resonates. Obviously, I love Robin, and I love his book.
But hey, that's why we have listener lines. 1-833-READALOT because I love hearing your thoughts and your reflections. So thank you, Phoebe, for being brave, making the call.
If you're listening right now and you want the push, here it is. What's one thing you liked? What's one thing you didn't?
What's a guess you want to have on the show? Or you can just call and say, what's one of your formative books? Hey, Neil, here's a book that changed my life.
Just let me know. I'd love to hear and play it for you. As always, if I play your message, drop me a line, and I will send you a signed book of your choice.
All right, let's move on to the letter of the chapter. I normally do this at the beginning. This time, I kind of just went right into boule.
So if I ever miss at the beginning, I'll do it at the end. Letter comes from Sarah S. Hi, Neil.
I want to let you know I've gotten my whole family onto the Rose, Rose, Thorn, Bud game. My husband, my 12, 11, and 9-year-old kids. We do it at bedtime.
The 9-year-old takes it so personally when the world doesn't happen as he wants to. Or thinks it should. And I've already seen a shift in his attitude even one weekend.
Day one, I started with the morning practice as well. But I can only remember two of the three, and I haven't been writing. Just thinking.
I will say I'm definitely going to spend at least two minutes deciding what to let go of and what to focus on every day before I grab my phone. Which is still in arm's reach. But I will get there.
Letting go of is easier than I thought. Most of the time, when I think about it later in the day, I can't even remember what I was supposed to let go of. Ha ha ha.
So I introduced the morning practice. At least those two pieces. I still haven't revisited my notes.
So the kids and the husband, too. Have a great rest of your week, Neil. Sarah.
Thank you so much, Sarah. You know, it's nice to hear from you. For those that don't know, Leslie and I end our days with Rose, Rose, Thorn, Bud.
That's the basis of our journal called Two Minute Evenings. And if you want a kind of a way to put it together, you can use that. Or you can just talk around your dinner table.
Just as a gratitude game to reflect on. And the only piece you missed in the morning there was, I am grateful for. Once again, when you think back and reflect on one or two things that happened that you're positive about, it's like a bicep curl for your mind.
Right? All right. That's the letter of the chapter.
And now let's move on to the word of the podcast. For this chapter's word, let's go back to Bule.
[Bulle]
Yes, indeed.
[Neil]
It is Afdabalon. That's two words. The first word is A-F, and then the second word is D-A-B-O-O-L-A-N, which means a closed mouth is gold.
If I research this online, this is one of the most famous Somali proverbs. Afdabalon, a closed mouth is gold. The opposite of what I do on this show, where my mouth is, my tongue is wagging the whole time, but a good proverb from the camel herding grandmother, now 101, that we should all think about and remember.
This is a journey, guys. It really is. When I started this in 2018, I didn't know where it would take me or take us.
There's a number of you out there that are Cover to Clever Club members. I mean, you're listening to every single chapter of the show. This was different, right?
We were in a different place, different time, different organization in the world. I didn't know what to expect. We got a really unique story.
For me, a really big part of this is sharing stories and building community. If you're here, if you're listening, thank you. Thank you for being part of this community.
I really love chatting with you and celebrating our love of reading together. If you're out there, drop me a line any time, Neil at GlobalHappiness.org. Letters that I read, I'll give you a signed book, as I always do.
And also, drop me a review anytime and make a phone call anytime, 1-833-READALOT. And now, until next time, until chapter 156, the last chapter in our little African sub-series, let's remember that you are what you eat and you are what you read. Keep turning the page, everybody, and I'll talk to you soon.
Take care.